You've recently emerged from a 15-year slumber only to re-enter the pop punk scene with renewed interest and ambition to contribute. What happened to Mutant Pop the end it the last time around?
In 2008 people were telling me that vinyl had “come back” and that I should try to do Mutant Pop again and so I dove back in focused on trying again to achieve one of my original goals — putting out 100 seven-inch records. What I discovered, to my chagrin, was that my mailing list had “gotten old” — many people had moved, others were starting families and migrating away from the music scene. At the same time, record stores everywhere were in trouble and the network of wholesale distributors had contracted mightily. Interest in Japan was not strong, the one distributor that I was trying to push as an exclusive was lukewarm. So I couldn't do a proper mailorder and I couldn't get sufficient support from distributors and expenses very greatly exceeded income. A repress of the Dillinger Four record sold out but I still managed to lose something like $5,000 in six months in getting the MP-31 Catalogs record done properly and three new titles out the door and some “last pressings” made. It was a bloodbath — I gave away one project at the test pressing stage (!!!) and never did press another for which I had already released 50 test pressings. Other projects were canceled.
So that was it, there was no way in hell i was going to get to 100 titles. I was done with doing a label.
What have you been up to for the past decade and a half?
I have a shoe store to pay the bills but I’m a historian by avocation. I dove into research on a book project on the history of American radicalism from 1916 to 1924 and building a personal library to support that effort. At some point Paul LeBlanc, a historian from Pennsylvania, noticed my research website in a cul de sac of the internet and intuited that I was one of only about, shit, I don’t know, maybe half a dozen people that knew or cared about the 1930s political faction headed by Jay Lovestone, the defrocked head of the American Communist Party. So he drafted me into being the co-editor of his current book project, which was finally published in 2015 by Brill in the Netherlands as The “American Exceptionalism” of Jay Lovestone and his Comrades. I learned a great deal about book research and publishing doing this project.
In the course of my book research on American radicalism in the 1910s and 1920s I typed up dozens of articles and speeches by Eugene V. Debs, the Bernie Sanders of his era, an icon of American radicalism. The vast majority of these had never been published in book form. A friend in California had a contact on the editorial board of the Chicago publisher of the paperback edition of the Lovestone book and he — after years of pushing — convinced me to put aside the general history of radicalism and to focus on Debs. We pitched the publisher, Haymarket Books, for a six volume series The Selected Works of Eugene V Debs. They were enthusiastic. I’ve been working absolutely full out on that project, with the first three fat volumes now on the street and the fourth manuscript about ready to be submitted. I churn out about one 700-page volume a year.
So what re-ignited the flame for pop-punk?
I’m not sure there was any one event. Matthew from Something to Do Records in Seattle knew about my untouched wholesale inventory in the shoe store basement and conned me into digging through the rubble to pick a couple orders for him over the years. I guess that at least got me thinking about music again beyond the CD player in my car. I became intrigued by the whole Bandcamp model which had emerged, in which bands were at least theoretically able to bypass the old-fashioned label-based music industry entirely, making their own stuff and selling it to fans. And I bumped into a few of the Mega-Massive Digital Compilations put out by Ramone to the Bone Records — over 100 bands on a comp, easily downloadable, for "Name Your Price.” Think about that! It’s revolutionary.
But nobody wants to listen to a seven-hour compilation, so I started toying around with sequencing these things down to “normal” 30 to 45 minute compilation albums. Whoops! Holy shit! The best of the best of these bands were great! Pop-punk wasn’t weak and dying, it was actually strong and things were accelerating! My old labeldude juices started to flow again...
I still have book commitments for the next couple years. I can not go all-out with the label immediately like I did I April and May 2021. But — I'm on the hook again. We’ll see if I can temper my tendency to be monomaniacal with my hobbies!
A notable happening of late was the simultaneous release of two Mutant Pop tribute albums, consisting of tributes by many of the active contributors of the current scene as well as some notable MP alumni. What were your thoughts when you heard this was going to happen? And how did it feel to kick back and listen to both albums?
The planets are aligning weirdly this year is all I can say. What are the odds of two different projects happening simultaneously? I adored every single aspect of both of these projects. One of them was a last minute surprise. For the other, Grath Madden, one of the principals of the 44 Golden Greats! project, was in communication with me fairly early on. I ended up whipping up a little prize for him to include with physical copies of his comp — watch for that, ha ha! Both comps turned out fantastically! seriously, I had been listening to 100+ band comps in which about half was bilge. These two together, there were no more than about three tracks that were not solid efforts. It was really touching, really inspiring to kick back and listen to those. They are a great testament to the songwriting ability of the bands I was lucky enough to put out.
As you've been meticulously combing through the sand that makes up the last 15 years' worth of pop punk releases, what has stood out to you as being particularly relevant/good?
It is hard for me to identify releases from my Rip Van Winkle period that stand out. I have learned the bands and their work, but the big events, the watershed releases, are absolutely outside my consciousness. Let me just say that The Briefs are one of the best bands in the history of American punk rock and leave it at that, ha ha! See, I left everybody out that way!
But I will say this: the thing that intrigues me right now are the home recordists, people such as yourself. Some, wonderful, wonderful sounds are being created in home studios. There are a couple of these home recordists who are doing harmony-forward pop-punk and I’m all over that like a duck on a junebug. That’s the exciting part of today’s music scene.
And how do you take this new approach in which digital releases have become a priority, and physical copies are now often very limited or made-to-order?
Fuck streaming. Seriously, if you think $9.99 paid every month to the Very Big Corporation somehow absolves you of support the underground network of music creation, you have forgotten everything and learned nothing. Don’t think the $1.63 of your subscription — or whatever — that trickles down to 10,000 bands somehow absolves you of your duty to financially support the scene, whether that be bands selling their stuff directly or labels doing their thing.
We can get into a discussion of the made-to-order model, which is a rational thing — but the reason the world is devolving into LP pressings of 300 in three colors for $25 a throw is because labels have lost all hope in doing anything else. And it is because of the idiots who do nothing but stream from Spotify. That has got to change before labels can become vibrant and fun again.
Mutant Pop's legacy has, among other things, inspired many would-be songwriters to actually do it. Your role as a permission-giver and DIY example-setter have also inspired many would-be label owners to go for it. The result is now a very vibrant and connected International scene where communication and collaboration have never been easier. Do you feel proud to have contributed to pop punk's lasting vitality?
I appreciate the nice words. Our music is much bigger than any one of us, obviously, but I am happy and proud to have done my part. It’s wonderful seeing so many of the kids who cut their teeth on the dorky Mutant Pop catalogs doing their thing moving into middle age, either as musicians or label dudes. This is your prime time. The next wave of pop-punk starts now. Reach the next generation of kids.
As someone who's clearly a connoisseur of good songwriting, and as an author, what has your own experience been with songwriting specifically? Are there T. Chandler demos locked in the vault? How would you describe the differences and similarities between literary writing and songwriting?
Me, a songwriter? Oh, no no no no!!! Here is an old joke: “What do you call a person who goes to shows and hangs around with musicians? Answer: A drummer.” That’s me or it was when I actually played drums a little many years ago. Songwriting starts with a guitar. I wouldn’t know a barre chord from a barcalounger.
Here are my top skills: (1) identifying top-tier harmonies pop-punk bands; (2) sequencing CD programs; (3) coming up with goofy ideas to appeal to collectors; (4) getting people to notice what I am doing and convincing them to care (2008 catastrophe notwithstanding). Oh, and from back in the day: (5) doing daily mailorder properly. Here’s what I do badly: (1) Everything else.
One observation I couldn't help but make as you returned to conversing with old friends and new allies in the current scene is that you've emerged from cryogenesis without knowledge of the negative stuff that invariably happens in any scene - the feuds, the blacklisted bands, the rumors, the in-fighting, the "untouchables", etc. It's definitely a thing and perhaps it's human nature. What has your response to that been?
We are all on the same team. Factionalism has been the historic bane of American radicalism and that applies to our community equally. The music scene is already factionalized more than enough by genres. We all need to pull together against the real enemy — the corporatization of music.
Stop dissing the fucking Kobanes. If they were idiots fifteen years ago about something or other, forgive them. Move along. A couple of those dudes are the truest, bluest, purest pop-punkers on the planet. True fact. And stop dissing Ramone to the Bone Records. There’s not a single fucking label, none, zero was screwed over by unauthorized downloading harder by the old Ramone to the Bone than Mutant Pop. The new guy, Markus, is honorable. He is doing things right and he is working hard and building things for bands. Get over it.
Do your own thing but remember — you are not competing with anybody. We need to build together.
You've apparently embarked on the adventure of preparing the first MP release in a very long time. Can you tell us about it - how did the idea first come about, how did you end up choosing this particular band, and what are the official plans for this release?
Let me quote the incessant blabbermouth T. Chandler, writing the essay on the back of MP-1028, Nerd Gets the Girl: Soda Shop Romance SRCD... “Then, suddenly, completely without warning, on New Year’s Day of 2002 my interest in punk rock returned. No, more than that, my passion for poppy punk had roared back, totally unexpectedly, as fanatical as it ever was. Eighteen months’ worth of demos were excavated from my dung heap of a room. Two bands in particular were astonishingly brilliant: The Teen Sensation Glasses and Nerd Gets the Girl.”
I was able to put out one but not the other in 2002. In 2021 some songs done by Ryan of TSG landed in my lap at precisely the right moment. He hadn’t done anything pop-punk-wise since 2005. Like I say, the planets are aligning strangely this year...
MP-523, The Teen Sensation Glasses: Focused CD will release July 1. So will MP-2001, The Teen Sensation Glasses: Fuzzy CD. There’s your scoop!
How do you find the scene in general since you've now become more familiar with current goings-on and the significant happenings that led us to where we are in 2021? How does it compare to the 90s in terms of community, quality, and overall vibes?
I think the 1990s were better musically than the 2000s, that the 2010s was slightly better than the 2000s, and I can feel the earth moving in the 2020s, just like I felt it in the 1990s. The market is different and the new generation of kids haven‘t arrived yet, but I can feel it. Can’t you?
What is it about discovering new (and specifically homegrown pop punk) bands that gives you such a thrill? Do you feel that this kind of music is universal and timeless in its own right?
I believe all label dudes are drug addicts. We’re addicted to adrenaline. There’s absolutely no bigger thrill than discovering something great and bringing it to the world.
Thank you T. Chandler!
My pleasure.
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