GRIM DEEDS
Hewhocannotbenamed: You are the most prolific songwriter I know. What is your creative process? Do you start with a catch phrase or a riff? How long does it generally take for you to complete a song?
The process will continue to evolve, but my main method revolves around either a song topic or an emotive melody that gets stuck in my head, usually when I'm in the shower or riding my bike. Those are my two favorite songwriting activities. Then I'll pause to grab my phone and sing the melody and whatever lyrics/phrases come to mind. Sometimes that's enough to guide the rest of the song and everything falls into place. Other times I have to come back to it, but in general my process is fast because I just go for it and don't overthink it. I maintain a song titles note pad on my phone and keep my voice memos updated. Then it's just a matter of timing the recording. Lyrics come easily most of the time. I've always loved rhyming and matching syllables to rhythm. Usually the emotion behind the song is rooted in something personal, so that motivates me even more to get it out of my system. I could easily record a song a day if there was time in my schedule. That part is the most challenging aspect, but my goal from the beginning has been to make it part of my life's routine no matter what.
Kody Templeman: Do you think humanity is nearing its end? Is it worth saving at this point?
As you know, many of my themes convey an extremely pessimistic future outlook for humanity. One of the science concepts I teach is carrying capacity, which is basically an organism's maximum sustainable population. Our own exponential population growth is unsustainable. As a father raising a young son it's deeply concerning. I fear Logan's may be the first generation to be forced out of complacency by either natural disasters, war, or perhaps a combination of the two.
The question of whether humanity is worth saving, or deserves to be saved, it a difficult one. I'm compelled by the idea that we're all connected, and that kindness and love are uniquely restorative to relationships and personal wellness. That's something unto itself that allows me to maintain hope of some kind. But the difficult part is measuring that philosophy against what I know to be true about human nature - namely that people can't help being cruel, selfish, and destructive so much of the time. How can we forgive ourselves?
Dr. Frank: Is there a difference between the songs you choose to do under the Grim Deeds “persona” and other songs, and if so what’s the difference?
There is a difference, and that difference has more to do with my intentions for the song than it's style or lyrical content. Grim Deeds songs are my ego's offerings for the audience I've managed to build, and are based mainly on personal struggles - though I manage to throw in some commentary and humor now and then. Songs or projects I do apart from Grim Deeds are purely for songwriting practice. I tend to write "songs about nothing" in those situations, because my focus is on the craft of arranging and composing rather than communicating. Sometimes those exercises lead me to better Deeds songs. Other times they just scratch the ongoing itch to create.
I want the people I write about to discover their songs, in spite of the foreseeably unpleasant consequences. It's a thrill in a sense, but also a cynical experiment to test my theory that no one actually gives a shit. It's kind of amazing what you can get away with despite the whole "cancel culture" thing. I suppose keeping it on a small enough scale is the key.
Hayley Crusher: What are the three most common negative re-occurring thoughts you personally have to push through every day to physically sit down and make art?
My public and family life are incompatible with my artistic life. Being a teacher makes it risky, and my wife isn't supportive. My family doesn't really get it or care enough to investigate, and almost no one in my daily life knows about it or would care to.
My artistic goals are driven by egocentric needs. Without an audience, there would be no point. Yet building and maintaining an audience requires constant, ongoing work that involves a lot of lame self-promotion. I've always struggled with this aspect and still question how it comes across.
There is peace to be found in anonymity, especially these days. The temptation to unplug and give up the dream for a simpler, less frustrating life remains an appealing option.
Still, I remain compelled to do it and am constantly inspired to write songs. I'm grateful for my abilities and feel the best way to honor them is by being prolific and making use of what time I have left.
Jason V: Shame-attacking is an exercise where you do or say something bizarre or humiliating in public to overcome your fear of embarrassment. The very personal subject matter of your songs, as well as your emasculating stage attire seem to be a form of shame-attacking. Is this the case? If so, has it been therapeutic?
You once described the Grim Deeds persona as an "avatar for human suffering". That's pretty accurate. Everyone will find their own version of Grim Deeds if they dare to take an honest look within themselves. We are all deeply flawed, but there's hope in the connections we make with one another. Comedy and tragedy often go hand-in-hand, and can bring us closer to understanding ourselves and the nature of life. My attire, the self-flagellation with socks, all of it represents a form of communion in which we can share a therapeutic laugh at my expense while acknowledging that the joke's actually on all of us.
Jason V: Since you have been part of the “scene” for quite a while. I’m just going to go ahead and assume that any notion of punk rock heroes and legends is long gone for you. How has it changed your outlook realizing that even the Ben Weasels of the world are just every day schlubs like the rest of us?
There's a unique and lasting humiliation that can result from interactions with heroes gone wrong. What I've learned from my own experiences is to keep my intentions in check at all times. Sincerity comes across just as clearly as self-serving social power moves, and I'd rather enjoy the natural ease of the former than the awkward tension and potential fallout of the latter. Like many lessons in life, these are ones I had to learn the hard way.
Still, I’ve made a habit of reaching out to people who inspire me. Sometimes it’s backfired and resulted in a social miss, but it’s often been an affirming, mutually cool experience. I’ve met several of my close friends that way, including you and other interviewees on the blog. Friendship is one of life’s greatest gifts, so to me it’s worth the risk.
It's fitting that this question should come from you, Lars. You're a great example of what a one-man project can be with the right approach and attitude. I'm incredibly inspired by what you've accomplished and your natural talent for songwriting which becomes more potent and refined with each release.
But enough about you! For me it's very difficult to imagine being in a band, mainly due to the constraints of my family life and work schedule. I'm lucky to have experienced being in a band with great musicians who are also close friends. When it works, it's great. I didn't realize until later how rarely it works. I tried a few more times, but the stars never aligned like before so I decided to pursue the one-man path wholeheartedly. I haven't looked back since, though I do love playing live with a band so I'm eager to do that again before too long.
Also, as noted frequently by my pal Dave Parasite, there's only so much enjoyment one can inspire via GarageBand's robot drummer. Real drums, real amps, and real humans playing instruments always sounds infinitely better. I feel like I really fucked myself that way since the majority of my catalog sounds like what it is - shitty home recorded demos. But 14 albums in, I'll probably continue doing it my way for better or worse. It's a great feeling to be your own boss in that regard.
Dave Parasite: I have noticed, both in your interview with me, and other ones I've read on your blog, that you sometimes ask your interviewee if they have an unspoken affinity for heavy metal. Are you simply looking for comrades in arms, or looking to form an army of twin guitar solo warriors that is capable of leveling Tokyo?
I aim for make-up that watches off easily with water. Most of the time I have to rush to put it on in the bathroom of whichever venue I'm playing. It's usually stressful and annoying, plus I have to be careful not to stain the sink or get in people's way. The last time I put on the make-up I played to an empty room! #balladoftheopeningband
The process will continue to evolve, but my main method revolves around either a song topic or an emotive melody that gets stuck in my head, usually when I'm in the shower or riding my bike. Those are my two favorite songwriting activities. Then I'll pause to grab my phone and sing the melody and whatever lyrics/phrases come to mind. Sometimes that's enough to guide the rest of the song and everything falls into place. Other times I have to come back to it, but in general my process is fast because I just go for it and don't overthink it. I maintain a song titles note pad on my phone and keep my voice memos updated. Then it's just a matter of timing the recording. Lyrics come easily most of the time. I've always loved rhyming and matching syllables to rhythm. Usually the emotion behind the song is rooted in something personal, so that motivates me even more to get it out of my system. I could easily record a song a day if there was time in my schedule. That part is the most challenging aspect, but my goal from the beginning has been to make it part of my life's routine no matter what.
Kody Templeman: Do you think humanity is nearing its end? Is it worth saving at this point?
As you know, many of my themes convey an extremely pessimistic future outlook for humanity. One of the science concepts I teach is carrying capacity, which is basically an organism's maximum sustainable population. Our own exponential population growth is unsustainable. As a father raising a young son it's deeply concerning. I fear Logan's may be the first generation to be forced out of complacency by either natural disasters, war, or perhaps a combination of the two.
The question of whether humanity is worth saving, or deserves to be saved, it a difficult one. I'm compelled by the idea that we're all connected, and that kindness and love are uniquely restorative to relationships and personal wellness. That's something unto itself that allows me to maintain hope of some kind. But the difficult part is measuring that philosophy against what I know to be true about human nature - namely that people can't help being cruel, selfish, and destructive so much of the time. How can we forgive ourselves?
Dr. Frank: Is there a difference between the songs you choose to do under the Grim Deeds “persona” and other songs, and if so what’s the difference?
There is a difference, and that difference has more to do with my intentions for the song than it's style or lyrical content. Grim Deeds songs are my ego's offerings for the audience I've managed to build, and are based mainly on personal struggles - though I manage to throw in some commentary and humor now and then. Songs or projects I do apart from Grim Deeds are purely for songwriting practice. I tend to write "songs about nothing" in those situations, because my focus is on the craft of arranging and composing rather than communicating. Sometimes those exercises lead me to better Deeds songs. Other times they just scratch the ongoing itch to create.
Dr. Frank: Do you ever worry that people whom your songs are about or refer to might discover them?
I want the people I write about to discover their songs, in spite of the foreseeably unpleasant consequences. It's a thrill in a sense, but also a cynical experiment to test my theory that no one actually gives a shit. It's kind of amazing what you can get away with despite the whole "cancel culture" thing. I suppose keeping it on a small enough scale is the key.
Hayley Crusher: What are the three most common negative re-occurring thoughts you personally have to push through every day to physically sit down and make art?
My public and family life are incompatible with my artistic life. Being a teacher makes it risky, and my wife isn't supportive. My family doesn't really get it or care enough to investigate, and almost no one in my daily life knows about it or would care to.
My artistic goals are driven by egocentric needs. Without an audience, there would be no point. Yet building and maintaining an audience requires constant, ongoing work that involves a lot of lame self-promotion. I've always struggled with this aspect and still question how it comes across.
There is peace to be found in anonymity, especially these days. The temptation to unplug and give up the dream for a simpler, less frustrating life remains an appealing option.
Still, I remain compelled to do it and am constantly inspired to write songs. I'm grateful for my abilities and feel the best way to honor them is by being prolific and making use of what time I have left.
Jason V: Shame-attacking is an exercise where you do or say something bizarre or humiliating in public to overcome your fear of embarrassment. The very personal subject matter of your songs, as well as your emasculating stage attire seem to be a form of shame-attacking. Is this the case? If so, has it been therapeutic?
You once described the Grim Deeds persona as an "avatar for human suffering". That's pretty accurate. Everyone will find their own version of Grim Deeds if they dare to take an honest look within themselves. We are all deeply flawed, but there's hope in the connections we make with one another. Comedy and tragedy often go hand-in-hand, and can bring us closer to understanding ourselves and the nature of life. My attire, the self-flagellation with socks, all of it represents a form of communion in which we can share a therapeutic laugh at my expense while acknowledging that the joke's actually on all of us.
There's a unique and lasting humiliation that can result from interactions with heroes gone wrong. What I've learned from my own experiences is to keep my intentions in check at all times. Sincerity comes across just as clearly as self-serving social power moves, and I'd rather enjoy the natural ease of the former than the awkward tension and potential fallout of the latter. Like many lessons in life, these are ones I had to learn the hard way.
Still, I’ve made a habit of reaching out to people who inspire me. Sometimes it’s backfired and resulted in a social miss, but it’s often been an affirming, mutually cool experience. I’ve met several of my close friends that way, including you and other interviewees on the blog. Friendship is one of life’s greatest gifts, so to me it’s worth the risk.
Jason V: If you woke up tomorrow and were unable to take off the mantle of Grim Deeds (corpse paint, wedding dress or sweat pants/socks combo) how would your life change?
Since I’m essentially living a double life with Grim Deeds as the hidden and secret version, I imagine that my public and family life would be spectacularly ruined. My only hope would be some kind of “going viral” situation that might lead to miraculous prosperity. Otherwise I’d be fucked.
Danny Vapid: I believe life is short with a series of choices. Why write songs and not something else?
Songwriting offers a channel and positive outlet for people who might otherwise be defeated by life. It gives me a way to transform my dysfunctions into this thing that people can possibly relate to and enjoy. There's really no better feeling than writing a good song, except when other (especially like-minded) people acknowledge it. Theres also a sense of community among songwriters that is very special. We are able to tap into something that most people can't really access for whatever reason - something that is more sublime than being able to shred on guitar or sing in perfect pitch. There's also a sense of pride that comes from committing to the labor of completing and recording songs. It's a legacy that has the potential to prolong one's relevance, which is compelling in itself. No one wishes to be forgotten.
Andy Social: Tell me about your early days as a musician...
I've been obsessed with music from an early age, but I became a musician mainly due to my realization that I'd never be a pro skateboarder. Before my early 20's I'd never been in a band or played an instrument consistently (trombone in middle school notwithstanding). Although I could write songs in my head, I never realized them until the age of 25. By then both ankles were destroyed from a decade's worth of skate injuries, so I finally accepted my fate and picked up a guitar. Music became my new skateboarding, essentially.
John Jughead Pierson: Your song writing is very prolific and on top of that well constructed. Two questions, does this come quick and/or do you spend much time editing? And you stick to a very formulaic pop song structure but your lyrics imply a deeper understanding, do you purposely construct easy musical structures?
Thank you, John. In general the songs come quickly and I usually commit to the first draft. The formulaic pop structures are what I prefer to listen to as well as create. I've always favored straight-forward, traditional, minimalistic pop songwriting. If an idea is compelling enough, then it needn't be overstated. I do purposefully juxtapose lyrical depth with simplistic arrangements, and often catchy melodies with dark song concepts. My aim is to provide listeners with an enjoyable experience that also involves facing painful truths about life.
Lars Hanneman: Would you prefer to have a "real" band if you could instead of doing the one-man thing?
Lars Hanneman: Would you prefer to have a "real" band if you could instead of doing the one-man thing?
It's fitting that this question should come from you, Lars. You're a great example of what a one-man project can be with the right approach and attitude. I'm incredibly inspired by what you've accomplished and your natural talent for songwriting which becomes more potent and refined with each release.
But enough about you! For me it's very difficult to imagine being in a band, mainly due to the constraints of my family life and work schedule. I'm lucky to have experienced being in a band with great musicians who are also close friends. When it works, it's great. I didn't realize until later how rarely it works. I tried a few more times, but the stars never aligned like before so I decided to pursue the one-man path wholeheartedly. I haven't looked back since, though I do love playing live with a band so I'm eager to do that again before too long.
Also, as noted frequently by my pal Dave Parasite, there's only so much enjoyment one can inspire via GarageBand's robot drummer. Real drums, real amps, and real humans playing instruments always sounds infinitely better. I feel like I really fucked myself that way since the majority of my catalog sounds like what it is - shitty home recorded demos. But 14 albums in, I'll probably continue doing it my way for better or worse. It's a great feeling to be your own boss in that regard.
Dave Parasite: I have noticed, both in your interview with me, and other ones I've read on your blog, that you sometimes ask your interviewee if they have an unspoken affinity for heavy metal. Are you simply looking for comrades in arms, or looking to form an army of twin guitar solo warriors that is capable of leveling Tokyo?
Heavy metal fandom is a good litmus test to see how likeminded another person might be. I've found that many pop punkers have an affinity for metal, but some (like you) can't tolerate it really at all. I find it interesting since there are similarities between the genres, and yet a key difference is the tone and "seriousness" of each. Both should be taken seriously but there's also room for humor in each case, according to me.
Prabu Pramayougha: Do you have any specific brand for your on-stage make up? Any L`orreal or Nivea endorsement soon?
I aim for make-up that watches off easily with water. Most of the time I have to rush to put it on in the bathroom of whichever venue I'm playing. It's usually stressful and annoying, plus I have to be careful not to stain the sink or get in people's way. The last time I put on the make-up I played to an empty room! #balladoftheopeningband
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